Children With Guns
 

Every parent have a responsibility to protect children from gun related death and injury from a loaded gun.

We recognize the risk to children of unsupervised access to guns in the home, and understand that there are common sense that adults must take to protect children.

Children live in a home with unlocked and loaded guns, most parents think that a child would not play or touch a gun in the home.

There have been a study, that will show that parents with small child, are unaware of guns in the house, and how they are stored. Parental misperception guns in the home endanger household members, suicide, and unitentional injuries.

In our country, guns are 'against the law'. Now count up the percentage of gun related injuries, deaths or other kinds of crime involving guns in USA compared to rest of world. It's quite staggering. I have seen the figures, but not recently.

Without guns, there is no such risks as you suggest. Who needs a gun? Also so many gun accidents happen in USA (forgetting the gun was loaded, etc., at home, hunting, etc.) It seems too much of a John Wayne hype to have a gun, walk into town, etc. bla bla. Such an attitude I thought was from the years of the 1800's not the 2000's. The psyche in USA is so .. on the wrong foot. (Old Western 1870's style arming oneself seems never to have left the deep down psyche.)
Outlaw guns, have amnesties for gun returns including some recompense for their costs, use the propaganda of the media to train people into thinking guns are bad & not needed. And strong jail terms for possession of such after the amnesty has finished. These do bring the point home to people. It's worked elsewhere.

The gun lobby in USA is so incredibly strong. No USA government in their right mind would risk losing office due to outlawing them as many if not most other countries in the civilised world have done (ie: outlawing weapons of most descriptions.) It's a very brave step but one that should be done eventually. Will 'any' USA government be brave enough to take this step, like governments in many other countries have?

One of the issues is, there are so many arms manufacturers in the USA. They are producing so many weapons they don't know what to do with them, thus they end up everywhere .. on the streets, in the hands of people who should not have them, even overseas in the hands of USA's so called enemies via selling via agencies in friendly countries who transport/sell them to the 'other' countries. Of course the weapons manufacturers know about it, they try to mask it all. The weapons industry in USA is a big money producer, big job producer, etc. so they have so much pressure over the USA government.

How many school or restaurant or workplace multiple shootings happen in USA & how frequently? Compare that to the rest of the world. It's ridiculous. If such offenders had no such access to those weapons (instead of borrowing from parents or easily purchasing at the nearest gun store.) USA citizens seem to think they MUST have a gun for their own protection. Well, everyone survives a lot better in other countries (as statistics show), which shows guns for self defense are not needed.

Just my opinion of observation as an outsider. :) We throw water bombs instead. jk lol :D (What did I do with my water pistol)

US bought guns smuggled into the UK.
 

Forum Members

Here a clever chap from the US who decided to go into the export marketing business, i.e. smuggling readily available guns from the US to criminals in the UK.

Is this chap an entrepreneur or a merchant of death?

Here's the story: BBC News - Police hunt US-bought guns smuggled in hold luggage



UK Bob

Gun Politics In America
 

Firearm rights in the United States, has been the most controvesial in America today.

This debate, has been characterized by individual rights to own a firearm in our home.

The majority of people in The United States want more stricter firearm enforcement of our current law.

American people belive in the Conatitutional right to own a firearm in the home.

I don't recall reading about guns in the USA constitution, but anyway. lol

For what purpose? To shoot people right? In so-called self-defense? That's still the old Western John Wayne way of thinking.
It's that way of thinking of feeling as though MUST own a gun. Feel empty & defenseless without one.
If the control over guns & their removal from 'everywhere' was carefully done as in other countries, then no need for one.
If the so-called threateners do not have a gun, then why should anybody else have one? Gun for self-defense in that scenario is ridiculous, overkill to say the least. It would be giving the defensee the same 'POWER' thinking in their mind as the invader if they had a gun. The old western shootout thinking & bluffing. If the invader did not have a gun, why would the defensee feel the need for one? POWER gone to the head? Amazing what a gun in the hand does to ones mind hey!

So how do you remove the guns off the streets, out of the hands of the common criminals? A long hard trek but it's mostly do-able. Sure, like UKBob's link suggests, there's always the heavier crime figures who find some way of obtaining them.

Per head of population, the gun deaths in USA compared to other countries in the world is quite amazing. Short notice so I haven't sought to re-find such figures. Perhaps you can search yourself.
The latter. ;) A conman; deep down knowing. He was selling to crime gangs &/or gun dealers so knew what he was doing & what the guns would most likely be used for. IMHO

Conslitutional Right
 

The right to carry and bear arms is a Conslitution right, and we should be allowed to protect ourself by law in America.

The right to bear arms that protect all other rights under the Conslitutional law in each state in the United States Of America.

Therefore, if the right to bear arms is lost, then all other rights will surly be losts as well.

Then I will arm myself with a nuclear bomb, it's my constitutional right to protect myself from those beings who could be spies from some enemy country. Or perhaps nuclear is not big enough. Perhaps I'll just put a pin hole into the earth & let the air escape. :D

Well there you go. Perhaps that's the issue. The way the laws are set up. If someone bounces through the window without my realising, I should shoot the bastarrds with a sub-machine gun for giving me a hell of a fright. Throw a grenade or two out the window at their car where their friends are waiting, or better still .. use a rocket-propelled bazooka with plutonium tipped shells.

So where do we draw the line? The way it looks, USA citizens can define that as 'anything' goes for defense. It's "MY RIGHT under the Constitution" to defend myself, my family & my neighbors. Blow the consequences. Laws don't matter. Killing is there for the taking when someone comes into my house uninvited. Any excuse will do. Oh damn party crashers. lol :D

Thus, looks like the laws are pretty stuffed if the authorities give that permission for people to bear arms at any consequence.

When people arm themselves for self-defense, their invaders will make sure they are more heavily armed. Just goes by logic. ;)

You have been brought up in that moulded society & way of thinking. So you cannot even consider any other possibility. Such as no arms, no guns, nobody possessing guns.

As I suggested, the ridding of weapons out of general society has worked mostly in many countries in the world. The average person does not even think about the concept of guns. Why .. because there's a multiple year jail term for anybody caught with a gun in their possession. Here, same applies to many other weapons, perhaps with lesser punishment depending on the weapon. At the other extreme, a rapid fire gun will gain them bonus jail term & maximum punishment. And that's only for weapon possession. If the person actually had the weapon in their hands in a threatening manner around others, then they could expect bonus charges against them.

The aim? A non-violent society. A non-violent approach to solve issues. Something some people have no idea about because such thinking does not exist in their culture.

my gun makes me the equal of a 250 lb fat pig out to get me...you can take my gun from my dead hands after I unload it into you and your cohorts..

criminals will always get guns, end of discussion...any other thought is propaganda and/or ignorance

Does not counter what I said about how the injury & death toll & crime rate related to guns in USA is so far above the rest of the western world.

Sure in every country in the western world there are illegally possessed weapons. But the more the hard on approach against weapons goes, & the longer it lasts, the deepers such carrying of weapons disappears into the dark worlds .. usually only of organised crime groups & gangs. Not of the average criminal. 'That's the difference.'

In USA someone only needs to go the a local gunshop like a corner milkbar lol or not sure the USA term for it (candybar), to buy a weapon. lol :D Just a quick walk around the corner & they're suddenly armed, just like that. Potentially with weapons previously used by the USA armed services. That in itself is ridiculous.

OK forgive me. I should not be saying anything that is seen as offensive against your 'culture'. Guns are a part of your culture. And you wonder why such 'gun-like' psyche attitudes & aggressions that shows through is disliked by so many other countries in the world. Perhaps you are not aware of that though. After all you only know what the local news tells you. lol :D

Do Guns Really Kill People
 

Do people kill people or do guns kill people, this is a question that many people ask. A person would have to point a gun and pull the trigger in order to shoot at a person.

The problem is that a gun is not so easy to control by people that have no experience on how to handle a gun.

Therefore a gun is dangerous in the wrong hands, they just point and shoot at anyone around them.

Even a stun gun, use by police officers can kill a person, that has a history of heart problems and other health issues.

Now a knife is also a weapon, that can kill a person and could be far more dangerous then a gun.

its not all that simple to get a gun in the USA...maybe for a shot gun or hunting rifle, but certainly NOT for a hand gun....

also it is very hard to find real statistics on the subject of casualties, etc...why?, because one has to take into account the number of people in the county, the number of guns in legal possession, etc...simple statements like "only 100 people died in Britain from accidental gun discharges and 10,000 in the USA" make no applicable sense simply because our population is much higher and guns are legal here whereas they are not in Britain...get the point? anti-gun proponents will not present real statistics because they don't prove the point they wish to make...

our founding fathers gave us the right to bear arms for specific reasons, one of them being SO THAT WE CAN TAKE OUR COUNTRY BACK FROM THE CURRENT DAY CORRUPT LEADERS...get that point?

as far as accidents...just a thinning of the herd...harsh, but most likely necessary IMHO...

Gun Safety
 

People think it's best to have a gun in the home to feel safe at night when they sleep so no one will harm them.

There are people that lockup a gun, to keep children from picking one up and shooting someone.

When a person who owns a gun they need to know how to handle a gun first. Is it the right for anyone to shoot a person with a gun, when they are upset, NO, anyone that has anger issues should never be able to own a gun, this law policy should be enforce.

There is no right to harm another person with a gun.

Forum Members

I have to take issue with Peerless on a point he has made, namely, The fact is there is no point, if a hundred people died in the UK because of guns, accidental or not, there would be public outrage and politicians would be calling for greater gun restrictions than we already have.

However, if 10,000 people died of guns in the US who would really care, apart from the relatives of the victims. It seems that guns are so endemic within US society that it takes a number of gun victims killed in quick succession before anybody takes what has happened seriously, like a school massacre.

So you see, it’s not a matter of statistics, it’s a matter of lives lost to guns and whether your society cares enough to do something about it. Sadly, it seems that Americans don’t trust their authorities to control guns or to protect them from the criminals and mad men who carry them. Hence, the “right to bear arms”.


UK Bob

There are people in America that will agree/diagree, with a gun enforcement law policy in each state, in America.

The right to own a gun in a home will depend if this person is stable to have one. The right to protect a love one in the home and to know when to use it.

whatever....you Brits are totally under the thumb of your corrupt elite...now, if you had some guns you might have a chance of ousting them, but you don't...shame...

and of course its statistics..sheeshus

All I can say is, there are three types of lies:

Lies, D@mn Lies and Statistics.

pure statistics are 'pure'....and yes, the variables can be manipulated to give most any result you desire (usually by deleting a factor that negatively affects your agenda)..

be aware you are conversing with a person who has a very high level of mathematical proficiency and knows what he is talking about..and yes I have run my fair share of statistical models...

as with anything on this corrupt planet facts can be manipulated and oftimes be completely fabricated, and those that do the fabricating get away with it (for the majority of people) because the people are ignorant sheeple who can barely add and subtract let alone do any sort of statistical modeling...in the present argument its pretty basic...(number of gun 'accidents)/(size of population)..

are you capable of understanding that?

If we pointed to a particular city or two in USA, where the no. of gun related deaths or gun crime is greatly above that of other world cities. After all, if I recall correctly the stats I saw some time back were pointing to city stats, or at least mentioning them to show how they compare to some countries totals. :D I believe gun crime is particularly high in some USA cities. Demographics probably plays a part.
OK easy for me just to say this, be good if I actually researched to see if I can find the information I read so you could make up your own mind.

Yes I agree about how stats can be used.
Another example is surveys, where they deliberately survey a particular group of persons of one kind instead of a wide demographic & cross-political range, etc. Carefully hiding this fact at times in their written research plan specifics & how it was 'really' carried out.

Peerless

Question, am I able to understand pure statistics, statistical modelling, etc. maybe not.

Am I capable of understanding the number of lives lost in a given situation, well, as a normal guy, I think I am.

Therefore, I cannot accept an argument where lives are dehumanised and broken down into a format that very few people can understand and don't really care about.

That said, we are clearly dealing with two different cultures that cannot understand how we can have such opposing views about the same subject, i.e. guns and lives.



UK Bob

well...dunno what to say other than to potentially insult you by pointing out that IMHO you have been well brainwashed by your society...

look at history...when people don't have a means to protect themselves they HAVE to look to the rulers (almost always corrupt) for 'protection'...and if they can't defend themselves from their 'peers' then they have not a hope in hell of protecting themselves from the ruling 'elite'...

All I can really say is that I hope I am not brainwashed, I can still think for myself and recognise propaganda when I see it.

You know, maybe human beings are incapable of living without corruption and violence and that the "civil society" we all aspire to is an unobtainable myth.

But I hope the apocalypse that you see coming, like the economic disaster you foresaw (caused by the banks), doesn't happen.



UK Bob

Presently China is busy buying up USA land & businesses. Oh .. of course China is not of any risk to USA. Despite China recently designed an anti-aircraft carrier missile (I wonder whom they were thinking of when they designed it.)

Oh & who cares China shows no respect to the international copyright & patent laws. They just copy it all & put their own name & interface to it. then sell it over the internet. :D With China's economy so high now, & despite improvements in infrastructure compared to some years ago for producton, one could argue China is no longer the preferred cheaper alternative for production other than their cheap staff wages. Oh well, I guess the USA & European company bosses still see a few $ being saved at the sake of local jobs which they obviously don't care about.

Made in China or was it .. made in the state of Taliban. Company bosses probably don't really care. :D

Don't buy their products is one way to show repentence & demonstration.

I'll definitely never buy anything made by the Sony company (-> Sony boss is RIAA head). And Sony sacked lots of local bands when they took over our local major recording companies & studios. Oh a friendly bunch Sony are. :rolleyes: And don't Sony & RIAA 'care' about the music bands & artists .. like yeah sure. Just a throw-away item to them.

Oops off topic.

buy China?

tainted with melamine and lead?

you're kidding, right?

LOTR

China is also buying up land and businesses in other countries as well, such as parts of the EU and Africa.

From what I understand, the primary businesses China is buying in Africa is causing some resentment because they are undercutting home grown traders and putting them out of business.

Whether we like it or not, world economic and political power are moving eastward.



UK Bob