I have LimeWire Pro 4.9.37 running on my MAC in OS 10.4 Tiger with 768 MB RAM. I have two issues:

1. Hang Time

When a song download reaches 99% completion and enters the "verifying" stage, the whole screen freezes. My mouse moves but nothing in LimeWire can be accessed or clicked on. When I attempt to delete a NEED MORE SOURCES search, or any failed search, from the Download Window, I click CANCEL or simply select the items and hit the delete key on my keyboard. Either action causes a similar screen freeze, and I am locked out of LimeWire until the freeze releases. I measured the hang time: about 50 seconds lost PER SEARCH DELETED. So if abortive searches accumulate in the D/L window, as they inevitably do for an active user, when I go to clear these out, I am facing a HUGE stretch of dead unusable time. If I clear 10 inactive/incomplete downloads, for example, I am locked out and stranded for about ten minutes - I measured it. Obviously, frustration runs high in the face of such delays when I could be busy sharing other tunes. In addition to the "verifying" and "canceling" freezes, other inexplicable lockouts also occur - and they typically last for minutes as well. If this a bug, is there a way to resolve it? This can't be considered acceptable, can it?

2. Hard Drive Fragmentation

The folks at the local Apple store are, alas, not fans of LimeWire; but, if my issue above can be settled, I am a fan. I do, however, have this concern. The Apple "genius bar" guys all agreed that LimeWire is aggressively unhealthy for my MAC hard drive because, they say, it deposits downloaded files at random all over my drive and causes excessive fragmentation, leading to slow performance and eventually to damage. Is this true? If so, what measures can I take to reverse these effects? I do already notice that running LimeWire dramatically slows down any other open apps on my computer, including i-Tunes, which of course must be open. I have plenty of RAM, so what can I do to reduce this effect? And what hygenic steps should I take to protect my drive?

I look forward to your responses.
Thanks very much.
madlad (madlad888@sbcglobal.net)

P.S. Just as an aside (and I know LimeWire didn't cause and can't control this), it is truly astonishing how many songs on LimeWire are misdescribed: wrong artists, wrong titles, etc.

Fragmentation: If you were using OS 9 or earlier then what the mac guys said would probably be at least partly true about fragmentation. However the way OSX handles files, fragmentation is much less important. Not unless you're trying to capture high definition video onto your computer. So basically I'm quite surprised what they told you ... basically 'almost' nonsense. However, I'm a person who sets their computer up for particular purposed. I have 2 internal HDD's with one split into 5 partitions & the other into 2. One or 2 are for video capture & rendering, etc. (more when needed.) One for OSX system, one for OS 9, one for applications, one for documents that are static, one for virtual pc, etc.

Whilst LW is open for about 15 mins or more, go to the LW Prefs (command & comma) & go to Bug Reports & click for a report. I want to know 2 things. At the top of the report it should say which version of LW & Java you're using. I want to know the version of Java!!! Also, half to 2/3 way down it will show incoming this session. Does it say true or false, sample image here: Bug Report instructions & sample image Is the result True/False?

Your problem sounds like a Java issue. Java for OSX is not over-efficient. There's ways to reduce this eating up of ram & virtual memory (VM).

Approx. how many incomplete files do you have? Approx. how many shared files do you have?

How large is your hard disk drive (HDD) & how much space is remaining?

Do you use the Resume/Find Sources function at all? If yes, how many files at one time do you apply it to?

Go to Utilities folder & open up Activity Monitor. Tell us how long LW has been open & how much RAM, how much VM & how much CPU % LW is using.

When did you 1st start using LW?

Hi LOTR,

First of all, thanks! I appreciate so much your diligence and generosity. To begin, tell me this: are my complaints about "ungody freezes" typical? Do others experience what I describe? Is there hope of a fix?

OK, I will attempt now to answer your questions. I just deleted about 10 aborted "NEED MORE SOURCES" searches from my D/L window, so LimeWire will be locked for at least 10 minutes or more. I cannot even access Preferences, or any drop-down menus. My mouse moves but all functions of LW are frozen. I have to just sit here watching the pinwheel spin. Why, I woner, should simply deleting items cause such a hassle???

1. I started using the program when I got it, early December. I'm a seriously advanced record collector with11,000 LPs and 6000 CDs. I enter LM, launch about 3-8 searches, wait for the results to tumble in, then I scroll for higher bitrates (160, 192) since I like quality. I select some songs and press download. Some connect, many do not. But as soon as a D/L hits 99%, everything freezes. The "verifying" stage causes a very long freeze.

2. OK, here's my Bug Report:

LimeWire version 4.9.37 Pro
Java version 1.4.2_09 from Apple Computer, Inc.
Mac OS X v. 10.4.3 on ppc
Free/total memory: 45986776/118226944

Received incoming this session: true

I can't find anything that says "sample image" or "bug instructions" so I don't know what the other thing is that you want. I can just paste the whole report in here if you like. It's all Greek to me.

3. I allow 2 shared files, if "shared file" means uploads. I'd be happy to do more if you recommend it. As to incomplete files, do you mean aborted searches? Like a NEED MORE SOURCES search? If this is what you mean, they pile up fast in the D/L window. Tonight, for example, I tried to D/L "The Love You Save" by Jackson Five, and about 10 straight tries failed to connect. Maybe it's too late at night. So at that point I like to clear the D/L window, which of course freezes LM for a long long time. And yes, i do use the Resume/Find Sources function at times, but my % success with that is close to zero. From experience I've learned that I have a better chance if I wait a day and try the search over from scratch.

4. My G-4 i-Book has 37 GB available, but I store all of my i-Tunes songs on an external 160 GB LaCie HD, and that has 58 GB available. I have 768 MB RAM on the i-Book.

5. Activity Monitor

I don't see anything here that says how long LW has been running, but it has been a few hours.

% CPU is btwn 7.1 and 9.5
Real Memory Size: 178 MB
Virtual Memory Size: 480 MB

OK, that's what you asked for. I hope it means something!

Gratefully yours,
madlad

The problem with OSX & LW has always been Java. OSX's implementation of Java has not been very good. People had been crying out updates to Java. Actually Mac have released a later version but is only available for Tiger users. I've been told it does improve performance somewhat. I don't know how much because I still use Panther OS 10.3. But may I suggest you update your Java to 1.5 & then use the java preferences utility (found inside the Utilities folder) to force LW to use Java 1.5 instead of 1.4. LW will not use Java 1.5 unless you tell the Java to make itself available for LW.

Follow all the directions here: http://docs.info.apple.com/article.html?artnum=302412

I must say, LW's cpu usage on your computer is considerably low. Mine tends to be much higher.

About your LaCie external drive, do you find it slows your computer down at all when you connect it? Do you use it to share your music with LW? I ask because I use the same size LaCie drive & I've had nothing but problems with it. I wrote a very cheeky thread about it here: LaCie 160 Drive Problems (click link) Where it is not only unreliable but slows my computer down when I share it. It believe it also resulted in some of my programs freezing. I only use it occasionally for sharing now. I'm still trying to decide what to do with it. Try an experiment. Try not connecting it to your computer & using LW. Do you suffer the same problems with it not connected?

Here's some other ways to reduce Java's high usage of Virtual Memory (VM) & RAM:

Keep the all of LW's windows closed unless you really need to use them. eg: The connections window & the Library window. Don't use the Show incoming searches in the monitor window unless you're running as an ultrapeer.

Set all uploads & downloads for auto-clear; ie: the drop off the download/upld list as soon as they've completed downlding/uplding.
Close off some search bars if they start to get into 2nd row & if they're relatively old searches. If you're not in front of your comp, then hide LW in the dock. Also Don't use the Resume button on all incomplete files. This can have side-fx such as affect LW's connection quality. May queue your files for much much longer. This will also stress LW & your comp. If you use Resume/Find sources then just apply it to a couple or so at one time. After opening LW wait 10 to 20 mins or longer before using. Let it settle down 1st. Lastly, one option you might consider, which I very rarely do is Tip: Purge the Downloads Queue!

on my comp (windows xp) if i try to D L the same song that i already have on the screen, mine freezes also.

the quickest way i have for unfreezing is (1) don't double-up, or

(2) ctrl>alt>delete. when i hit those i get the error message about <(you already have that file idiot)> or something like that. it unfreezes then i cancel the first D L, then get the next. you have to clean up incompletes in your library tho, as Lord... mentioned.

p.s. be sure to have the "quality" column on your search screen, it tells you whether you have that song already or not. file w/checkmark, is downloaded - broken file, incomplete.

Gentlemen!

A breakthrough!!!

When you guys mentioned something about deleting "incomplete files," I assumed you meant the dead-end searches in the D/L window at the bottom of the SEARCH page. This is because (as it may by now have occured to you) you were dealing with a genuine idiot, and this idiot had never actually ventured beyond the SEARCH page. I noticed but ignored the 3 tabs that say SEARCH/MONITOR/LIBRARY at the top of my screen. So tonight, fumbling about in exasperation, I tried opening LIBRARY, and there they were - hundreds of incomplete files. So I deleted them all. And just like that, the freezes ended. For the moment. Now, when a song completes a D/L, it just vanishes into i-Tunes, and when I cancel a search, no hang. So. THANK YOU! It's important to bear in mind in these chats just how dumb some of your peers may really be.

I still cannot access Pro Support, so let's focus on that if you have any thoughts. BUT. I no longer have any burning need for them either. Except to say that I might share my bewilderment over a search engine that makes no apparent distinction between ARTIST and TITLE. Just now, for example, I wanted a tune called "Jam" by A Tr*be Called Qu*st. I entered "Jam" as the title and the group as the artist, and received 295 matches for Jamie F*x, J*mes Br*wn, and J*mes T*ylor, all of whose names begin with jam. Does it actually mattter in LW what you put in which search fields?

One other thing. I've noticed, more than once, that there are some songs you just can't get, no matter how many matches you see. I tried D/L-ing "Y*u Don't *wn Me" by L*sley G*re. Hundreds of matches, many with 5, 6, or 7 sources. I tried about 25 of them, and not one would connect. It's as if all 295 sources for that song are the same guy - and he's out of town. What's up with that?

Anyway, I'm out of the woods on the "ungodly freezes" issue. Is there anything else on that LIBRARY page, btw, that I should know about or do? And LOTR, should I still upgrade Java?

Gratefully Yours!
madlad

Please don't mention copyright names & files within forum posts. Forum Rules (click here)

Yes a large incomplete folder will put pressure on LW. It's up to you whether you upgrade to the next Java or not. It's not compulsory, but if you have further problems it might be worth considering. Java 1.5 should be able to handle these issues a little better.

As far as searching goes, I rarely use the audio type search. I use the Any Type search & type in artist - title. eg: joe wang - little more
If you know the album it comes from you may even want to try adding that to the search also. As long as it doesn't make the search too long.

Sometimes you need to stop the downld if it doesn't connect by pressing the stop button, then reselect the file from the search results. Also, doing another search can often help promote the file to start downlding. See the following link & follow “ALL” the off-shoot links to find hints & extra skills to help: To continue files downlding (click on link) & I suppose this one Cant search well help

What do you mean you can't contact Pro Support? Send me a pm by pressing the pm button below my post & send us details.

I am not sure , but if you mean by "allow 2 shared files" that under Limewire/Preferences/Options/Sharing/Shared folders that you are only sharing two files with others, then it may mean people you are trying to connect to are not allowing it because they have their settings set for P2P users who share more files. (Limewire/Preferences/Options/Advanced/Preferencing/Files You Must Share Not To Be A Freeloader and Allow Freeloaders) I notice that in my queue a lot of people queue up for something, but when their turn comes for the upload slot, if they are not sharing (sometimes I allow freeloaders; others not), they may not the file they are requesting. If that is not what you meant, never mind!

There are times I am attempting to spread a file out there; my hard drive space is very tight, and I have a lot of big files I am trying hard to spread so I can burn them onto CD and move on! For me it does no good to spread them to people who aren't going to share in return. Sometimes I let everyone have a file with no stipulations, as I realize some people are new and do not realize that their Upload and Download speeds and connections do not interfere with each other.

None of the below may help you reach that guy who is continually busy, but in case any of the below helps ... here it is. Maybe more information than you need!

Other things you can do to ensure a more successful download experience:

I enable Preferences/Upload/Basic/Partial Files/Allow Partial Sharing. I feel it is only fair, since if I am downloading from 5 hosts at once, it is 99% likely because they have enabled partial file sharing. Partial File Sharing is the P2P equivalent of BitTorrent's "swarming" and everyone benefits and gets the file faster. Some people don't share partials because they want to verify the file works first; I have a different method. When I finish a download, I can check the file and verify it, and if necessary report it to Bitzi.com if it isn't working. (Actually, because Bitzi.com doesn't have a Mac OS X client - except through Terminal which I don't use -- I can't report through Bitzi unless someone else has already reported it; I can add comments and rate the file, though.) I also share completed downloads. Limewire/Preferences/Options/Sharing/Download Sharing enable/check "Share Finished Downloads"

Other things that may help your downloads (I find uploads and downloads are related; it is more likely you can see them if they can see you) which you may have already done are to

(1) make sure that under the Monitor tab that "Show Incoming Searches" is enabled/checked. The default is "Show Last 32 Searches" which I generally change to 1 which seems to speed up my system a bit. I wish Limewire would make this incoming Search a default setting so when one turns on Limewire one can automatically enable it. Until Show Incoming Searches is enabled, I seem to be invisible to anyone on P2P. (This may not be the case but it appears so.)

(2) Make sure you have configured your IP address and port to show up under Push requests. Limewire/Preferences/Options/Advanced/Firewalls (search this forum for "firewall")

(3) Keeping Chat enabled makes it easier for people to search me, though sometimes they cannot for unknown reasons, and sometimes I am able to browse myself and other times I cannot; again for unknown reasons (even when I disable my firewall and am not connected to my router, I am not always able to browse myself). But Chat enabled seems to make it more likely (though not always) for someone to get through. Limewire/Preferences/Options/Chat/Enable Chat There seems to be a direct correlation that the easier I am to search, the better my connection is with other users.

(4) Under Limewire/Preferences/Options/Bug Reports, I had to set mine to "Always Discard All Bug Reports" before mine would operate properly under OS X (I do have the correct Java version). Otherwise I was getting a lot of crashes.

(5) Sometimes I have problems with the Limewire OS X skin; it appears to have bugs in it. You can verify this by changing to another skin or two, then changing back to the OS X skin; it will probably have retained some color and aspects of at least one of the previous skins you tried. Changing skins sometimes leaves my OS X skin unreadable; at other times it appears to make it more stable and less prone to crashes; so I don't know if there is any relation.

(6) If you are asking for a very large number of files from the same host (more than three, I'd say), be careful; they are liable to block you as being greedy. I had one person attempt to upload about 50 music files. I don't care as I have it set so that each person can upload 1,000 files if they want. But for reasons unknown, for this person Limewire was allocating four of my eight Upload Slots to this person; and they filled up about 6 of my 10 Queue Slots! If each person only fills up one slot, that is fine and normally the way Limewire works. However, whether it was a Limewire bug or just a fluke, one person was taking up multiple Upload Slots so I killed their upload. With some hosts, you may find even if you are taking up only one upload slot, they don't want you uploading too many files; so maybe just try a few first.

For speed/performance issues with Limewire, you may want to check Preferences/Options/Downloads/Download Bandwidth and make sure it is set to something other than Unlimited that is within your test range (there are sites to test your Download/Upload speed; try here http://www.speakeasy.net/speedtest/ (note that before taking that test, make sure Limewire's Upload and Download speeds are set to Unlimited, or your results will be inaccurate and throttled! or do a search in this forum and it will bring up results; sorry I have forgotten links!). Likewise you can ensure that your Upload speed is also within your range under Preferences/Options/Basic/Upload Bandwidth. I do not throttle these very much; I try to set them to what my computer states it can handle for bandwidth. If I am sleeping and not using any other apps, often I will set both to "unlimited." If I am awake and using the computer, I will set both to unlimited unless I notice a slowdown; then I might tweak the settings a bit.

Some people do not realize that their Downloads do not interfere at all with their Uploads; so if they are trying to download a file they will throttle Uploads to almost nil. This is entirely unhelpful to everyone on the network as those are two completely different pathways coming out of your computer that have nothing to do with each other; like the north and south lanes of traffic where the flow of each has nothing to do with the other. I use this test http://www.speakeasy.net/speedtest/ and set each to results within that test.

Regarding Limewire fragging your hard drive under Mac OS X, if you are using one "Shared" folder to hold files you have recently downloaded that you are sharing with others, even if you are placing the files in multiple places later, I wonder what answer Apple would have to this question: what difference is this from when you introduce new music into your iTunes folders, or introduce digital photos, or any other type of file onto your hard drive? In other words, if one wanted to make that argument, anytime you add a file to your computer, even new email, you are adding clutter to your hard drive. I believe at the Apple store they usually reinstall the OS every night. Naturally their computers run as though "brand new" as a result. I am not sure; but I believe there may be some utility programs available that allow for a defrag of a Mac OS X drive, though that may be best addressed on Apple forums. However I don't think Limewire using a Shared folder is going to frag up your hard drive any more than normal. Nor do I think deleting Incompletes would slow your computer anymore than your emptying your Trash periodically. The slowdown you experience is more likely related to download/upload issues. You could also try disabling Ultrapeer to increase your computer's speed. Limewire/Preferences/Speed/Disable Ultrapeer Capabilities

Good luck! I hope you are able to improve your download experience.

__________________
Currently sticking with an older version of Limewire Pro 4.8.1, which has proven more stable

PowerMac G4 933 with ISP Brighthouse/Roadrunner broadband 15/2 connection running Mac OS X 10.2.8

~~~~~~~~

Details of my computer (firewall, RAM, hard disk), network set-up, country, and all can be found here: http://limewiresettings.jottit.com/

Haha, Hobo! I never got back to you about this thread: Upload Limit Reached - 1000 file limit; keep increasing Uploads Per Person?

I, too, keep saving that for when my brain is clear. Whenever that may be.

When it does clear up, if it does, I will reply to you over there about it, since it's in a topic heading in case anyone's searching.

__________________
Currently sticking with an older version of Limewire Pro 4.8.1, which has proven more stable

PowerMac G4 933 with ISP Brighthouse/Roadrunner broadband 15/2 connection running Mac OS X 10.2.8

~~~~~~~~

Details of my computer (firewall, RAM, hard disk), network set-up, country, and all can be found here: http://limewiresettings.jottit.com/

Deleting the incompletes has an effect on LW. It means it loads faster, settles faster, less VM drag due to the incompletes trying to connect on their own & LW handling the overall load. It's very much related to OSX's Java & its inefficiencies. I have a lot of incompletes & my LW runs slowly. Stief suggests someone on OSX shouldn't share too many files (above 2,000). I took out most of my shares so I had less than 100, & still my LW has some drag issues. It's due to the incompletes. So I am now more confident to have replaced my shares (though I keep them not much above 2,000 anyway b/c it does also probably affect things.) So why don't "i" delete my incompletes? Well I seem to still occasionally hook onto one of those that's been sitting around for a year or longer. Most of the files I seek are not common files. If there's a chance I might get these rare collector's files then ... And I do delete the odd few here & there anyway.

Defragmentors for OSX: I use Norton Utilities -> Speed Disk (but only very occasionally - less than in OS 9.) However I generally only use it on my other partitions & HDD's, rarely on the OSX partition (system drive.) The reason is I heard fragmentation is much less an issue in OSX due to the way OSX handles files. Perhaps if you're doing video work it would make a difference but I do my video work on designated partitions/separate HDD. BTW iDefrag is another OSX defragger but I tried it out & didn't like it. Incredibly slow & I somehow don't trust it.

View incoming: I always have this disabled since I feel it's only adding extra consumption of resources to LW & Java. M.O.O.

Speed test: LW should be turned off at this time so you can get a good idea of the proper speeds your connection is capable of. More tests here (choose nearest location): http://www.t1shopper.com/tools/speedtest/
But if they quote speeds in kbps (kilo bits/sec) then you'll need to divide that by 8 to give you KB/s (Kilo Bytes/sec) which is what LW uses.
After that you can try downlding a magnet link from here http://www.magnetmix.com/video.shtml to see what speeds you get thru LW.